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The idea of "The Rapture" held heavy sway in the Baptist household I grew up in. When I married, I became a member of The Lutheran Church-Missouri Synod, which DOES NOT teach about "The Rapture". Let me repeat that.......the LCMS is a Christian denomination which does not subscribe to Rapture teachings.
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A Google search of the history of the Rapture doctrine turns up much interesting information. In case you're not familiar with the Rapture concept, here are a few links:
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The History of the Pre-Tribulation Rapture (Pro Rapture); The Rapture Theory - Its Surprising Origin ; Rapture History (The final sentence on this page is interesting: This belief [rapture] is largely limited to the U.S.A.); History of the Rapture Theory; History of Rapture Doctrine .
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My personal opinion for a very long time has been that belief in "The Rapture" is popular because it offers the hope of not experiencing physical death. Face it......nobody wants to die.......its human nature to feel that way. Believing in The Rapture gives one hope that they just might not have to go through physical death.
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Another very amateur opinion of mine is that many sidebar Christian teachings, such as the Rapture, are with us as a direct result of the Bible becoming accessible to everyday people. Its no wonder the historic "Church" kept the Christian scriptures under lock and key for so many centuries. Evidently, the idea that Jesus might literally return at any moment to snatch believers away was not a useful doctrine. Remember........the first guys who attempted to translate scriptures into languages other than Latin, Greek, Hebrew, were treated quite badly by the Church authorities........read of William Tyndale........or John Wycliffe.
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I certainly wouldn't want to return to the days of being ruled by a greedy and corrupted Church hierarchy, but I sometimes wonder if the world would be better off if the Christian scriptures hadn't been made available to everyday people. Everyone started reading the Bible and making "discoveries" about prophecy and such. People are human, and can easily get caught up in doctrines that cause division and fanaticism. You see it in every religion, and I worry that someday there will be a violent, radical Christian faction in the U.S., just like there is in other religions. I was raised Christian and certainly consider myself one, but I sometimes feel that the world would be much better off without organized religions. If mankind ever ends up destroying itself, it will most likely be over religion. I used to hate John Lennon's song "Imagine", but parts of it are becoming more meaningful to me all the time.
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And, here's an interesting view that Sarah Palin may be a "religionless Christian".
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And......wow........here is an excellent post from a blog called "Thinking Out Loud". , which I just stumbled into. The author's name is Shirley and please read her "About Me", also! Here's one sentence from her post: We need to stop telling the world they need Jesus and we need to start living daily.....as though He is in us......living through us......because He says He is.......
Check out this blog, "Thinking Out Loud"!
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Like I stated early in this post, the Lutheran Church-Missouri Synod DOES NOT teach the Rapture or futuristic prophecy speculations, much to my great relief. The LCMS is basically low-key and sensible, and does not embrace emotionalism; religious fanaticism has difficulty taking root there.
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And, back to the subject of the first Bible translations........just think for a moment about this: People have been literate and have had access to reading the Bible for themselves for only a few hundred years.........before that there was over a thousand years of illiteracy and no access to the Christian scriptures. That's just mind-boggling to think about. Probably, out there somewhere, are groups who still live this way and would dearly love to see the rest of the world convert to a similar state of ignorance and blind obedience to an ideology, religious or otherwise.
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Lately, I've read of concerns that The Religious Right wants to turn the U.S. into a theocracy. In a true theocracy, the leader is considered a direct representative of God, and receives messages from God, which everyone must obey. Yikes. I would hope that's not their plan, but here's
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I also read recently on a paranoid website that pastors in the U.S. are being told by some government agency to preach more often on Romans 13:1-7, to remind their congregations that God wants them to be obedient to governmental leaders. As stated......that was on a paranoid website. But.....haha......keep your eye and ears open.......even in church! (The website said that Hitler had encouraged pastors in Germany to preach this way in order to make church people more obedient to the Nazi rules in the future.) Haha......don't you just love to hear stuff like this!! Its so paranoid!!
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Now that I've tossed a heavy thought at you........try to have a good day, regardless!! As I mentioned earlier, consider visiting the "Thinking Out Loud" blog........her insights are excellent.
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16 comments:
I dont see the teaching of the bible or prophisys as fearful or something to be afraid of I see them as a hope and a promise. I also believe in the bible and everything it says. I like what Shirley says because LIVING as though he is in us is a perfect example of the bibles teaching :)
Hello Jeannelle. I came to your blog via Chronicles of a Country Girl, which I read regularly. Was attracted by the picture of a cow as I too am a farmer's wife in North Yorkshire Dales, UK - so hello from one f.w. to another.
Thanks Jeannelle, for sharing about my blog! I think what I find to be the greatest thing about being in my 50's is the realization that I can freely think out loud! And from what I've read from your blog so far, that's where you are, too! Coming from the Pentecostal church where I was terrorized as a child by the sweating, screaming pastors pounding on the pulpits when they were not running back and forth across the platform yelling out a message of hell, fire and damnation ... it has been nothing but wonderful to actually see and hear for myself exactly what Jesus said/says and what exactly He means. I'm making up for lost time and loving life as I never did before!
I try to remain "middle of the road" but your post cries out for a response.
Tyndale and Wycliffe were indeed "treated quite badly" by the Church authorities. Tyndale was strangled and burnt at the stake. Wycliffe's body was dug up 43 years after his death and burned. I wonder if anyone became emotional over that. I get emotional when I read that you "sometimes wonder whether the world would be better off if the Christian scriptures hadn't been made available to everyday people." This view was certainly prevalent under the old Communist regimes.
Perhaps, deep down, you would like to see Sarah Palin and all Pentecostals and everyone who thinks there's going to be a Rapture or who doesn't agree with your view burnt at the stake. Then you could remain comfortably low-key and sensible, rejecting fanaticism with your friends. Yeah, right. And Luther needn't have bothered posting those 95 controversial theses on the Wittenburg door.
As someone who was not going to post any more about religion and politics, you seem to be in need of a good dictionary.
I grew up as a Methodist. One of John Wesley's famous sayings is "Live and let live; think and let think." I wish people didn't feel they always have to disparage and destroy and ridicule everything outside their own parochial circle. An eye is not a mouth. A hand is not a foot. Yet all are part of the body. Christianity, it seems to me, is larger than the LCMS, regardless of what the LCMS leaders may tell you.
Can't we all just get along? I hope the answer is "yes." Our parents were right when they said not to discuss politics, religion, or sex. Nowadays, that's all many people care to talk about.
IN THESE LAST DAYS, DR. DAVID JEREMIAH HAS WRITTEN A POWERFUL MESSAGE FOR ALL!!!!!!!!!!!
The pages of [NEARLY FULFILLED] end-of-the-world prophecies could make up a whole new testament. Now there's the Rev. David Jeremiah, an East County mega-pastor and TV evangelist who says the end is coming, in the words of a familiar church song, “soon and very soon.”
The Rev. David Jeremiah, pastor of Shadow Mountain Church, shown here in his ministries' broadcasting studio, has written a book exploring 10 "prophetic clues" he says point to the coming of the end of the world.
In a new book that hit bookstores this week, Jeremiah offers 10 “prophetic clues” he says point to an imminent conclusion many Christians have clung to for 2,000 years – the Rapture.
RAPTURE!!!! RAPTURE!!!!!!! RAPTURE!!!!!!
WOOOOO-HOOOOOO!!!!!
WOOOOO-HOOOOOO!!!!!
WOOOOO-HOOOOOO!!!!!
TEN CLUES!!!!! TEN CLUES!!!!! TEN CLUES!!!!!
YEAHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
OF COURSE, THESE TEN CLUES CORRESPOND DIRECTLY WITH THE TEN ESSENTIALS FOR ESTABLISHING AMERICA’S RIGHT RELATIONSHIP WITH THE WORLD!!!!!
IN THESE LAST DAYS, A WISE WOMAN HAS BEEN CALLED TO SERVE AMERICA, PROVIDING WISE COUNSEL ANDBOLDLY ANNOUNCING THE TRUTH, LIVING THE PROMISE UNDER THE FULL MANIFESTATION OF THE DEBORAH ANOINTING!!!!!!!!
WOMAN OF VISION!!!!
WOMAN OF VISION!!!!
WOMAN OF VISION!!!!
LIBERALISM WILL GO DOWN LIKE A FRESHLY KILLED MOOSE!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
NO MORE!!!!!! NO MORE!!!!!!
NO MORE!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
NOW IS THE TIME!!!!!!!!! YES!!!!!!! YES!!!!!! YESSSSSS!!!!!!!
NOW IS THE TIME TO SHARE THE MORNING AFTER WITH OTHERS!!!!!!!!
THIS POWERFUL FACT-BASED NOVEL IS CHANGING LIVES!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
SET THE CAPTIVES FREEEEEEEEEEEEEEE!!!!!!!!
FUCK YOU, PIAPS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
BWAHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Laura,
I agree.....our faith in God is about hope.....but, I also believe people can get way too caught up in trying to decipher biblical prophecies in a specific way.
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weaver of grass,
Thanks for stopping in here from a farm in the U.K.! Its great to meet you! Yes, doesn't Kate have the most awesome photography over there at her blogs!
I'm sorry you had to land on this Rapture post, though. I have many other posts with photos of the farm and cows, etc.
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Shirley,
Thank you for visiting! I was very happy to find your blog yesterday! Yes.....this getting older does seem to free up the inhibitions about speaking our minds. Good for you, and for all of us!
I'm happy for you that you've reached a more peaceful place in your walk of Christian faith. I look forward to reading more of your blogposts!
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Oh, rhymsie.....and your comment cries out for a response, too.
Isn't it great to be able to speak our minds!! Everyone has walked a different path in life, and its a blessing to hear their experiences and opinions.
Yes.....in my opinion, everyone in the world should be able to get along just fine, in spite of differences in religious beliefs. Blogging my opinion is not forcing beliefs on anyone. For me its about speaking out and encouraging awareness of issues. Lots of Christians----especially LCMS----have no clue about the beliefs of End-Timers. People need to keep their eyes open and be aware of things.....that's really the only point I'm trying to make with any of these posts. And, I do feel it would be a serious concern for the whole world if an End-Timer ended up in the White House someday.
(I thought I read on your blog yesterday that you wouldn't have time to read blogs the next few days......see, I was hoping you'd miss this Rapture post of mine!!)
P.S. - When I say LCMS doesn't get into emotionalism......I'm talking about during the church service. Our services are very boring.....we sing majestic but sometimes plodding old hymns and listen to pastors drone the Gospel message to us. Its very low-key and bland and boring.......peaceful, too.
ralph,
Thanks for sharing.
Oh my jeannelle...grin. You are certainly evoking responses. I am happy for you that you are finding personal truth. That is what it is all about. I think...wow...I too was raised in an 'organized' religion although those around me did not see it that way. What was not stressed was PERSONAL faith. Yep...personal faith. So...I 'retreated' many years into my own worship...and still remain for the most part there. My faith is personal...my relationship with God is personal...like the hymn says "I KNOW whom I have believed in and am persuaded that he is able to keep that which I've committed unto Him against that day'. I don't need anyone to tell me what is real or not real. Politics and relgion need to have a separate path...but it is inevitable that they cross. I don't have the answers but I too am fearful dear Jeannelle. Just don't let anyone discourage you as you walk in more and more 'light'.
Jeannelle, glad we're still friends. What I had said in my post at RWP was "Can't promise I'll get to the blog, and can't promise I won't." I was referring to *my* blog, not yours. :)
You have had your first t-r-o-l-l, I think. I think Dr. David Jeremiah would faint dead away to see his name linked with the t-r-o-l-l's comment. I liked your response to r-a-l-p-h, though. That's the spirit! Don't ever feed one of them. You just know he had been googling e-n-d t-i-m-e-s when he landed here.
And that's another reason not to bring up the subject!
I think you are correct that it is fun to grow as we age. Your posts are always worth the read, Jeannelle.
(And the only person I annoyed today was a Jehovah's Witness!!)
Okay, I've been thinking for all of five minutes or so now. Why do the end-timers bother you so much, Jeannelle? There are so many facets of faith, why this one? What about those who proclaim Christianity because it makes good politics, but their personal lives never live it? What about the other divisions within a faith community? I understand your concern that a leader driven by end-times panic might be influenced by that, but I don't think there are too many in politics (it would seem) who are so uni-focused (I hope that's a word.) Actually, I can't think of one. (See how that Jehovah's Witness rattled me??)
rhymsie,
Actually.....its probably good for people to see comments like ralph's. Its that old awareness thing again.
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caution,
Thanks for your thoughts and query. Don't forget.....I grew up with End-Time beliefs, and since I tend to be a person who takes things very seriously.....I took those End-Times beliefs VERY seriously when I was a teenager and young adult. So seriously that the thought of setting any future earthly goal seemed futile. So seriously that I was chomping at the bit to get married and have children so as to experience those things. Maybe that's the best way to live.....I don't know.
I don't care if people want to believe in a Rapture or try to decipher biblical prophecy.....as a hobby. I personally DO NOT believe that the prophecies in Revelation are decipherable. And I would be very interested to know where the prophecy about Alaska and Wisconsin being "refuge states" comes from......the pastor from Wasilla preaches that, don't forget. Find it in the Bible for me, caution. Or perhaps he had a special "revelation" from God. That's the kind of stuff that could eventually be dangerous.....people duped into believing that certain special people receive direct communications from God. That's why the ancient office of the Pope held so much sway, and popes eventually became intoxicated with the power and glory and....well, we all know the history.
Another "thought provoking" post Jeanelle. I think you and I are on the same cosmic wave length....once again, something along these lines was running rampent through my thought processes and then I hopped over to read your daily post.........Keep up the posting on this matter...I applaud you for being so brave and sending your thoughts out there while many think these very thoughts, but don't speak them......
Sending (((((HUGS))))) your way......
Hi, deserthen,
I'm happy to hear we're on similar wavelengths!! Thank you for your encouraging comment.
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To anyone who is interested in an indepth discussion and explanation of End Times theology.....here is a lengthy but very informative article:
Dispensational Theology
When it comes to the subject of the Lord's return, I think no further than this: "He will return someday." That's all I need to know. I certainly don't believe that a belief in a Rapture or Tribulation or any End Times detail is required for salvation. That involves faith in Jesus Christ....and that's it.....nothing else.
Jeannelle, you speak your mind as often as you wish. It is a horrid mistake to not discuss these issues openly. Secret and separate beliefs breed difference and separation. We must talk if we are ever going to find common ground.
The bible is a wonderful collection of stories of how a people viewed their God. Some of course like to make God so small as to consider it a manual. That is their right, but of course they lead to the mob scenes that pass for rallies we now see at McCain/Palin campaign stops. The anger and hatred and "otherness" expressed is truly frightening. This we/them mentality must stop it seems to me, and we must learn to respect everyone.
We can only discern the big lie when we bring it into the open and test it against the rationality of intellectual discussion.
I am so grateful for your emails and various links you have sent. Your mind is enormous and your ideas and thoughts are worthy of much contemplation by everyone who reads.
You need not defend yourself against small minds who can only see the world through a tiny knothole. You have the freedom to think and that is God given. Blessings my friend.
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